Getting yer RACK on

Submitted by Eric Daniel

I have a love-hate relationship with my web-gear.  Back in the day (the late 80’s for me) the only thing available was the LBE (Y-harness) and pistol belt.  While the LBE itself wasn’t good for much, it did help take the weight of the loaded pistol belt off your hips, and my pistol belt was loaded.  I carried 5 three-mag pouches, 2 canteens, and a butt pack (in addition to the regulation bent neck flashlight, compass, NOD bag and first aid pouch.)  In the pack went an MRE, socks, NBF powder and small toilet kit, alcohol pens and tape for maps and such, and trioxane tabs for cooking water. For years this arrangement worked because all of the dismounted stuff I did was truly dismounted.  We might get delivered somewhere in a deuce and a half or hummer, but we didn’t patrol in one; all that we did on the ground.

Then came “modern” times, where everything you do is “mounted”, even getting to the point that you can’t go 50 feet without having to get back into the truck.  That, coupled with the fact that “uniformity” was now our primary focus (meaning you had to have your kit on when ever you got more than 5 feet from your vehicle) meant that a change in how I carried my equipment was in order.  As much as I liked the canteens (with their attendant cooking stand and cup) and the butt pack, they both had to go.  There was simply no way I could ride in a humvee wearing my LBE with those canteens sticking out of my back like 2 cancerous tumors, and going through the chore of donning, removing, and stowing the LBE every time I got in and out of the vehicle was not only a waste of time and a big pain in the ass, but it was tactically unsound; you ought to dismount the vehicle in a fighting condition.

So I started looking for an LBE replacement.  The one I settled on was the RACK (Ranger Assault Carrying Kit.)  Developed by Specialty Defense, I’m told that it was developed specifically to meet the Ranger’s requirements for “assault” oriented gear.  The RACK, in effect, is a MOLLE apron.  All it is is a wrap around vest with MOLLE loops on it for you to attach bags and pouches too.  What you attach, where you attach, and how much you attach is completely up to you.  In addition, everything on the RACK is in your front plane, meaning you can see it and get to it without having to grope behind you, and with nothing behind you, you can wear it while in a vehicle without any discomfort or loss of mobility.

As great as I think the RACK is, it isn’t without limitations.  While the RACK is easy to wear in a vehicle because there’s nothing behind you, that does limit the amount of stuff you can carry.  I could carry more with my old LBE-pistol belt rig than I can with the RACK, but I couldn’t carry it all the time, so the trade off is now, if I go on walkabout, I need a bail-out bag as well (Camelbak in my case) to carry a few additional essentials.  The RACK, by today’s standards, is also relatively old technology – there are systems out there that are much more advanced than my lash up, made of more exotic materials and what not, but mine’s bought and paid for, and I’m disinclined to spend modern money to upgrade something that currently still meets my mission requirements.

Buy the RACK here

Comments

[Karen O.]

After having suffered through several military "abortions" of web gear, both Canadian and American...why can't the military get smart and develop something that is comparable to the comfort and useability of civillian heavy hiking packs...I've climbed mountains with civillian kit that is easier to deal with than what the military puts out. Maybe it's time to stop letting civillian "purse carriers" develop what is needed and listen to the needs of the soldier who has to not only carry it but use it...PPPPPPPPSSSSSSSSSSSTTTTTTTTTTT....no combat soldier wants velcro on their gear...might as well give the enemy a gps position.

[FJD]

This has nothing to do with the RACK, but rather the Velcro comment. If you are on such a secret-squirrel mission that the very opening of your Velcro pockets could compromise you and cause the mission to fail, you are probably a CAG, SEAL, or other operator who is free to modify your kit at will. You are not Carlos Hathcock sniper-crawling through the jungles of Vietnam. Someone please tell me about one time that opening your Velcro pocket inside a guard tower, LMTV, up-armored HMMWV, APC or even on a dismounted patrol through the city compromised your mission.

[Michael DeVries]

I can remember a time for awhile when the dreaded E-Tool had go the that LBE also. That billiant itdea came from a Post Commander who wasn't an infantry officer. Needless to say, as soon as we hit the field that useless piece of equipment went into the rucksack where it belong.

[SF]

To the idiot that made the second comment about Velcro. Yes you are right, there is little worry about giving your position away when there are not active combat operations on the go. But our soldiers also have the job of staying alive when they are under fire. Velcro is loud when opened and can and will give your position away. When our soldiers have been trained to be silent and deadly, the Velcro defeats the whole idea. This is the same reason why the military does not use zippers on their uniforms, but buttons. Your words indicate that you are military, but by your remarks, obviously you are not and never were in a combat arms branch.
All Cav!

[Donald Moore]

I was in the Army Infantry and I agree with the idea of eliminating all Velcro.

[RB]

The sound of your "velcro" can give your position away in an apartment building, let alone OP's and towers! For you guys trying out the civ-gear: if you find something useful and clever, why not suggest it higher-higher? Easy to do via email, and enough complaints COUPLED with viable alternatives/suggestions may bring about necessary improvements faster than the current system of supply or acquisition does.
Semper Fi!

[Edward Brown]

In the Second Marine Regiment in the Fifties, we wore the light marching pack, with a rolled ponch secured with short straps on the back of the LMP. It was okay for light gear. That, with the over the shoulder map case, was good for C-rat cans, etc. We also had plywood pack boards and canvas rucks with steel frames for heavy loads.

[Michael Schilling]

This is in reply to FJD's comments.
It is true that if you operate in spec ops you can mod your gear. here is the funny part, the same uniform that is worn by the guy in the LAV, APC, Standing watch in the guard tower, is the same guy who the next day could be hunkered down in a bush taking fire, because the velocro on his gear "that doesn't matter" just gave away his position.

You don't get "watch standing" gear and "combat" gear. One's with velcro and ones without.
Sh!t I was in the Navy, and I could figure that one out.

[Seth Mills]

I'm a retired MP, and used to be a grunt as well. If I was in an area where the opening of a pocket by Velcro would give me away, it just meant open very very slowly.
If I was already under fire I didn't need to worry about giving the position away.

[Anthony Harris]

1st 75th Ranger Reg

Rangers Lead the Way

[mh-sf]

Velcro...comments. I agree with Seth about opening your pockets slowly, the same applies for anything you do in the field whether opening your Alice Pack or any other piece of gear. Obviously some of you have never been in combat. As for the comment about the civilian rucksacks, I haven't seen anyting better than the Alice pack for being out in the jungle and mountains. Unless you are climing Everest, the Alice Pack (Large) seems to fit everything you need and then a few extra items.

[Randy]

http://www.kifaru.net/MGhome.htm
is a site that has a new pack that works, now we all know nothing works with body armmor is the pack is of any size. Velcro is a pain but I don't put anying in it I would need on a mission. my note pad is on the let and that Velco does not make that much noise. The Problem is all the gear we have not is not made to fit as a system, sure I can put 30lbs of gear on my vest but that kinda of kills the spine. The new vest may help, but what we need is a vest, that has as a system pouches and a two packs one for 48 hours one for 4 days. that put all the weight on the hips

[Pat]

I must be getting old. I was thinking about how hard it was to keep C-rations quiet in an ALICE pack! The couple of times I was ever under fire, it was so damn noisy, velcro wouldn't have mattered.
That said, obviously you wouln't want velcro in a place where noise discipline is an issue.

[Smoke Grant]

You all sound like a bunch of whiny West Pointers. Who cares about equipment you wear because all you need are the BIG GUNS!

STEEL RAIN!!!

[ME]

Hey the velcro flat out sucks. It wears out fast, thereby loosing the ability to retain items, a big no no. Velcro tends to attach to everything you did not intend for it to. As for the quiet issue except for the one super soldier who apparently bangs pots and pans as he is posting up on a door he is about to kick in we all agree it is a liability. The ACU was designed by REMFs for REMFs with its cute pen slots on the sleave. I got two words for you, pocket protecter. Nerd.

[Jim]

I still use my old Alice pack (Medium). I've been out of the Army since 1985. I was an RTO and had a large Alice pack. Those things were great. But I do have to agree about the LBE, if you had two ammo pouches on the front with grenades hanging off the sides, don't go prone unless you want to feel like getting punched in the stomach!

Jim Brown
SGT
1st Bn, 35th INF
25th Inf Division (Tropic Lightning)

[Tom De Young]

I have hated velcro since the first day they put it on the wrist closure on a field jacket. The stuff doesn't hold up and in so many and varied ways is just plain irritating. Certainly selected for combat uniforms by a REMF. A soft canteen was developed once - we had them in the late 60's and they worked great (2qt), easy to carry or put anywhere - could be easily redesigned again to work with current gear. For the old timer - keeping c-rats quiet in the field was easy - we shoved them in our spare pair of socks inside our packs. Thanks to all of you serving our nation today! God bless you!

[Tom De Young]

P.S. I always carried two regular canteens plus the 2 quart... just moved them to the r/l sides a bit and could sit OK in a chopper of vehicle; still had room for ammo pouches on each side... and a couple of 1st aide pouches on the shoulder straps... didn't want to get too much stuff up front when the need to hit the dirt arose... good luck guys.

[Blake]

To the “All Cav/ SF” knuckle head that did not realize its 2007 and we are talking about ACU’s. You said “This is the same reason why the military does not use zippers on their uniforms, but buttons” The biggest zipper I have ever seen besides my suit case is on my ACU uniform!!!

[Tom Porter]

Okay... enough comments about velcro under fire. Never had that issue... TacSat soldier... but that velcro SUCKS for working on Cammo!!!

[CPL Bultitude "Yankee" from oz]

Im a US citizen but im currently and australian army cadet (hence the nickname yankee round the diggers) and even i find the velcro to be annoyin if were runnin a tacticaL EX and i get my lil diggers to go to ground i can hear it openin and closin far off.

[Sgt. Pigg]

AS for the comment on velco, I am a grunt who fought with 3 I.D. in 03 and 05 in Iraq. I agree the velco and zipper B.S. needs to go. I was a Sniper in 05. I can tell you I used to spend up to 4 days at a time in O.P. s . Who ever tought of this is a major R.E.M.F. Also, the R.A.C.K. gear is great, until you have to go prone with it on. As a sniper in a Mech. Unit, I liked the Air Crew Vest the best. It is all MOLLE and you can set it up as long as you dicth the harness. Plus, you still have the back area for more gear when not mounted. I bought mine on E-Bay for about 40 Bucks. I dont know how that can kill a pocket book at all.

Sgt. Pigg

3-7 INF. 3 I.D.

[brad A]

I've been wearing the RACK since 2001. I love it! I will never use any thing else.

[SPC Towler]

Velcro, sure it can be noisy. My only problem with the velcro Hook and Loops not all of the ACU's are the same and every uniform that I have the velcro wears out in A week with my job and also when you wash them and they get tossed around in the dryer and everything gets stuck together when you pull them out. That wears them down and makes them a constant pain to have to check every five minutes to make sure it is still attached, I.E. cuff links and god forbid you put any weight in your cargo pocket like WLC we had to keep our Canteen in our pockets and the velcro just doesn't stick anymore. Buttons were nice in my opinion, I like the velcro because it's easier but like with anything there are Pro's and Con's, ACU's just have One Con and that is the Velcro. "Air Cav" 4/6 ACS

[Badkarma]

I have been a Cav Scout sneekin and peekin so close to the enemy that I could smell their feet! The last thing on my mine was to reach down and open a velcro pocket. My fingers were on the trigger and front grip of my M4 not getting pogey bait from my pockets. Now I am a REMF (25B) and I dont care who hears my pockets open when I reach for stale MRE chicklets because the 60K generator in the back ground is masking the crackle of the velcro and my shirt zipper as I take it off to play cards in my REMF tent. I agree that if you are in a situation where velco on your uniform is going to be a life changing event, chances are you will mod you uniform anyway. For some of you older soldiers you might remember that we (CAV types) used to move our lower pockets on the BDU shirt to the sleeves. Now the ACUs have sleeve pockets by design. Soldiers, keep making changes to the uniform thats that way changes are made. Sure it might piss off a few CSMs and 1SGs but they are always pissed off anyway.

[Lewis Haynes]

In the gulf war I used to throw the 2 qt canteens away and carry 2 bricks of 60 ammo in each carrier, I thought that was why they gave us the water in the cute bottles..... 3/7 Inf. 24th Inf Div...

[FJD]

To the guy who posted under the name SF: I was a 19D30. I had the dual role of platoon dismount-team leader for door-kicking and initial entry, and also Troop sniper team leader. I daresay I have kicked in doors, been on patrols mounted and dismounted, and done the cool-guy sniper missions. I have worked with CAG, SEALs and LRRS in Iraq. I have been on numerous two-way live fire ranges. Now I am a civilian, working with former members of CAG, SEALs, SF, and any other spec ops branch you can think of, on the ground in theater. I have experience with a variety of equipment. Your hostile remarks prove only that you like to complain. Adapt and overcome, and quit whining. It is people like you that forced everyone to have to wear the Combat Action Badge.

[Eli]

The RACK does rock! I like my MOLLE vest-its comfortable and bears the weight well,but putting it on top of my IBA gets cumbersome. Attaching pouches to the IBA solves the problem of carrying ammo,but not much else. It seems like I am always tweaking my kit. I have BLACKHAWKS version of the RACK in ACU and nothing surpasses it in comfort. As far as the Velcro,its handy,but it wears out way too fast-the ACU's are a step in the right direction,but generally suck ass-the cut is good,but that is about it,cant put anything in the cargo pockets,because they have velcro instead of buttons,they don't hold up to a stiff wind,much less anything else and anyone that has ever worn ACU's have had the velcro on their sleeve become attached to the velcro on another soldier's sleeve(if you have worn them you know what I'm talking about)in tight quarters- a small inconvenience,but not too masculine! for once the Marines have one-upped us when I comes to gear,in both features and color scheme.
ELI-29th I.D. (currently deployed) "29th-LET'S GO!"

[OldSP]

Wow, such hostility !?!?! The fact is that if you give 10 troops a new personal use item and ask them a week later to rate it, you will get 10 different answers (and 7 of them would have already mod'ed it). BTW: the reason buttons were and are used on uniforms in lieu of zippers is that a button won't get fouled by mud and crud. No other reason

[frank]

just a little comment about the so called 3ID sniper he calls himself sgt pigg well he was never a sniper or a sgt he is a poser

[AJ Powell]

Hey guys. About this Velcro conversation. I have a few things that just might make it a little easier on you.

As a Naval Aircrew Combat Search and Rescue Operator assigned to the teams, it is true that we have had the opertunity to mod out our gear as much as we want. However, its not all as most people would think. 99% of the time, the simple, time tested stuff that everyone elses uses is perfict for the job. Example, the RACK, MOD-O Vest, TAC-Float Vest, Blackhawk STRIKE, etc. However, yes a lot of them do have hook and pile for the closures on the flaps. But they also have snaps too and others have Side-Release buckles. These things are either very silent or make little to no sound at all, however, the velcros is still a problem. We have solved that problem by using additional pieces of velcro, attained by any supply shop, alci officer, or from issue, and stuck a hook piece to all the pile sides and a pile piecce to all the hook sides. Effectivlly, they acted a complete silencers and the velcro problem was solved. This is a quick, cheep and simple way to solve the problem and I hope it helps.

Aime High... Dive Deep... Leave No One Behind...
-AJ
AE (NAC/CSAR) USN
-So Others May Live-

[Paul Reamer]

I fit into the catagory of old jar head. Nam era old. When I first say the new uniforms with the velcro I imediatly knew that someone who was only concerned with how troops would look on the grinder or ie; gerret trooper capacity would appear, had designed it. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out it will never work in a tactical environment. However the Marine version it slightly better than the Army abortion, but its still a usless piece of gear.
Semper Fi, and a double Semper Fi to the Ausie.

[ODA18-4]

WOW! SO many freaking whiners and babies huh? How did you so-called heroes ever survive? Listen up girlies, velcro is for pussies and have never been good. Real troopers will immediately mod the gear and give a rats ass what the CSM or Top says...thats a fact! So yes, the developers of todays gear are wimps that want to look good as they are getting the shit shot out of them on the battle field. NO enemy will give a crap if your uniform is clean and starched or if your boots are polished. IN combat it is dirty and rough. NO time for velcro, it will give a way your position. Maybe that straight leg dont care, but many times non combat jerks are assigned to combat arms, and if ya got velcro, you will give away our position by reaching into your pocket for some damn tic tacs. So, get it right, velcro doesnt last long and it is freaking loud in any environment, even in boot camp you ought to learn to be light,silent, and deadly...that is your job........period!!!!!!!!!!!So lay off the bull and get to the real deal, fighting the skinnys that are layin waste to the velcro wearers---wear buttons----period!

[O'C AF]

Never really had to worry about noise discipline much. Seeing as how all i did was pump gas and change oil. I wish i did have more combat training though not much i could do if enemy tried to take the base other than throw a pipe wrench or something at them lol

[AusChook]

I use something pretty similar to a RACK, we (Aussies) call them battle bra's. I love it, I'm in a mechanised unit and it is so much more confortable in an apc then belt webbing. Belt webbing sucks, the only good thing about it is the amount of kit you can carry. I'll take the increased mobility and comfort a battle bra or chest rig gives you any day. If you need extra gear get rid of your canteens and take a camelbak or take a day bag. If you really need to be bombed up, your going to have you pack with you anyway.

These things are gold.

[James Mielke]

Time for another old soldier to chime in on the benefits of velcro on a uniform or on field gear.

Not only is it noisy, but it is damned near impossible to clean out... velcro attracts dirt, grass, weeds, lint and other crap that gets stuck in both halves of the loop and hook fastenings.

it frays which increases the problem, and if it starts tearing away from the uniform, chances are that the uniform will be trashed.

buttons were simple, secure, quiet and easy to replace in the field.

these new uniforms are just another example of some jacka$$ over thinking and over engineering the soldiers basic equipment.

Do not get me started about the M16 A2 or this new M4 with all that techno-geek crap.

[LRS]

I don't think there are too many soldiers who can get away with wearing a uniform any which way they choose like these high speed snake eaters are recommending. Most of us are in regular army units that require uniformity, at least in garrison and in conus. That said, I have a set of ACU that are unmodified for garrison and 3 that the velco on the pockets is replaced with buttons. Helps that I have an aunt who likes to sew. Velcro is obvisiously unsuitable for the field and if you are willing to shell out money for tactical gear then you should have the common sense to take some ACUs to your local sew shop and get them modified. Now if we could only DX them altogether for a pattern that actually works!

[RGR]

Never had the displeasure to use the stuff. Anyone who voices their dislike of the stuff has a reason. Those that like it, in my opinion have never been in combat. Heck, I remember I thoughts buttons made to high in the prone. If any item you feel comprises your position at the wrong time...one word
"KNIFE" it's your life and your buddies.

[Marcus Williams]

As the mission changes and the way the chain of command wants you to accomplish that mission changes, what we carry and how we carry it changes. Front, back, side to side however. Keep in mind...most soldiers cant modify their uniforms or equipment anyway they want to. Regular units will have regular uniforms and equipment.....special units will have special uniforms and equipment. Artillary doesnt need what a sniper needs. Combat Engineers needs are diffrent from a scout team. Any assault team or combat oriented person or group would obviously not like to be detected, however, the powers that be are not buying "ANYTHING" specifically for you or me or any singular person. So everybody...calm down. Adapt and overcome....suck it up and drive on. Engineer!!!

[ArmyScout1]

For eveyone out there argueing over velcro, zippers, packs, frames, etc, I just got medically retired from the Army after being hit by a VBIED in OIF III, I was in OIF I, all with 3ID, Fort Stewart, Ga. The new ACU's, you just wash them a few times and the velcro pockets arent that loud unless you are in a hurry and if your in a hurry your not worried about being loud anyway..., Anyther thing - The army just came out witht the whole new ACU Pack and its the most comfortable thing I mave ever used, I only deployed with it and one duffle bag and the other ACU pack that is used for 3-4 day pack which is freaking great, the newstuff they have come out with is great I don't know hoe to explain it. For once they have really thought about our needs. Now if they can just get it to everyone that would be cool. So guys relax the stuff is out there and if you don't like it go buy something else and stop crying your soilders not fashion police...

[Brian Burger]

I am a former SSGT and Still a Marine at Heart, Semper FI to my band of Brothers. The issue here is two fold. One area of discomfort, limited use and the ability to get out of a vehicle is solved by mounting the equipment carried by soldiers in the front verse the rear. The second issue of not being able to carry enough in the pouches of the "RACK" could be solved by incorporating Buttons and not snap buttons, so you could use and extender if need be to allow for more storage depending on your mission. I was with 2/7 on the infantry side and Made a Lat move to Artillery with 5/11. I have expeirence on the ground and in convoys. I was a Platoon Sgt with infantry and a Battalion and Battery Ops Chief in Artillery. With a Little constructive input i believe the issue can resolved quite easily. Remember each unit has different missions and your ability to use the gear issued and modify it as required is a on going battle in all the branches, utilize your platoon sgt or your Senior Member of your unit for help devise a good sound approach tactically and i am sure you can get yourself squared away.

Semper Fi

[John]

The only guys that used velcro when I was in back in 90-95 were the pencil pushers because the buttons left marks on their pockets when they ironed them. Of the three ways to secure a pocket, velcro, zipper or button, the button is the one that has the highest durability under all levels of stress - why would you change that... As for the LBE I used the Vietnam H suspenders and they were 100x's more comfortable then the Y suspenders
- 1/509th PIR JRTC

[Butch Broussard]

Sounds to me like the design of the vehicle seats need to be looked into with an eye toward making them more ergonomic for carrying troops that will be frequently dismounted. Basically, determine what kit arrangement is most advantageous to the dismounted troop that is geared-up for being in a tight spot and design seats to accommodate that arrangement. For personnel not loaded with combat gear, the specially designed seat could be brought to a more conventional arrangement with some sort of slip over adapter. Just an idea.

[angel mendoza alfaro]

podria dar mas informacion pero en español

[SSG Snake]

Ok, everyone has made valid points in the situation with the velcro, uniforms and the gear that we have to wear. Basically, if you need the gear, you will wear it.The basic responsibility is to stay alive, I believe it was mentioned. So think about that, every MOS is doing thier part, but I will agree that some are in more dangerous situations that others.Mount what you need on the vest, not what you want. Every person on the ground has a purpose and unless they are a complete and total a$$hole, if you run out of something, they will not leave out to dry. Every unit deploys knowing the guys they deploy with. My last and most valid point, every soldier, unless you have gone to basic training in the last 3 years has used some shitty gear, you were trained to accomplish the mission with that equipment, now I understand that every soldier has different needs as of today, it is what I think. As long as you have your boots, your ammo and buddies.Youll do fine.

[SGT K]

I love the guys that say stuff like, "I don't care what the SMG or Top says" and "If you're a real warrior...blah, blah, blah..."

I changed the configuration of MY IBA almost every day I was in country. Everytime I learned something, or found something that worked better, I changed it.

That being said, my teamleader at the time wore his issue LBE the entire time. Never had one fancy pouch. We both did fine. Both of us came home alive, both of us are wearing CIBs and ARCOM "V" on our class As.

It's all preference. I like my way. My buddy like his way. That's all. You don't have to go against regulations to get the job done. Operators don't do their job better because they are wearing baseball caps and have beards...

[ro]

whatever, the acu's just came out their not going to be changed. and people saying they wear their uniform how they want is lying unless they are sf. in our troop everyones molle vest had to be exactly the same or else. it is real stupid since everyone is different. but thats why those guys make the big bucks if you aint cav you aint sh!t

[Shoe]

They're all gonna laugh at you!!!!

[al]

The Velcro question-
anyone that's had any experience with velcro in the dirt knows how quickly it stops being velcro and starts being useless. a little sand and it just doesn't seem to work.

[Rich]

Facts:
RACK was designed at Natick Labs for the 2/75.
Buttons are for ease of field repair.
Velcro wears out, and is noisy. BUT, the only pouch closuer on your gear in (official inventory) that uses velcro is the M-4 double mag pouch. (ACU not the issue here.) If you have to open the M-4 pouch quietly you should have loaded your weapon hours ago..and you just shot a mag so the enemy knows where you are if you are reloading....
Think about this pepople!